Author Topic: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!  (Read 223 times)

jpigg55

SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« on: July 19, 2020, 05:28:04 PM »
Was out working in shop today to start cutting the last piece of the tire tool project for my friend.
I’d finished installing the taper attachment on the lathe a few days ago. The one mentioned in ”Sand Blasting”: https://www.machinistgazette.com/index.php?topic=1932.0
Looked GREAT !!!

Forgot to check cutting tool height on center. Not only was it off center, but it turns out the cross slide for the taper attachment is quite a bit thicker than the original. Tool bottomed out on QCTP and still too high.
Don’t think shaving off the bottom of the QCTP is an option. Milling off the top surface of the cross slide might be an option, but it might require taking off enough that it will get thin over the holes for the compound rest lock pins and screws.

Any thought/ideas ?

Guess I always assumed parts would be fairly interchangeable for lathes of the same make and model. I thought wrong.
SB 9A, Clausing 8520, Sanford MG 612

woodchucker

Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2020, 06:19:42 PM »
so it looks like you painted the machined area of the cross slide.
So that should be stripped down..


How much are you off by?
It's an AXA holder right?


I would measure the old cross slide vs the new. Find out where the height is. Are the dovetail area higher.
Whatever you do to make it right, don't forget that you need to match the taper attach.
I think you are going to remove material from the cross slide  somewhere.


I would not do the holders yet.  Make the cross slide close to the spec of the original.
Jeff
Clausing 8520   SB Model 9a - power hacksaw, Milwaukee band saw in a table.  Delta Rockwell Surface Grinder (not online yet .. being rebuilt where am I going to stick this)
For pics: https://imgur.com/user/woodchucker/posts

jpigg55

Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #2 on: July 27, 2020, 07:48:12 AM »
I took some measurements and the cross slide for the taper attachment is 100 thou thicker than the original. Taking that much off the surface would cut into the compound slide gib screw holes.
I don't think thinning out the cross slide is a viable option, too much to take off the top and not enough to take off the dovetails and re-machine. Not to mention it would effect the fit to the taper attachment.
I think my best option is to modify the QCTP tool holders. See if it's possible to shave off a recess area that would allow them to sit lower.
Oh, yes it is a Dorian AXA QCTP.
SB 9A, Clausing 8520, Sanford MG 612

woodchucker

Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2020, 09:22:34 AM »
that cross slide is not for a 9..
it's probably for a 10 or 10 heavy.
Maybe even a 12
Jeff
Clausing 8520   SB Model 9a - power hacksaw, Milwaukee band saw in a table.  Delta Rockwell Surface Grinder (not online yet .. being rebuilt where am I going to stick this)
For pics: https://imgur.com/user/woodchucker/posts

jpigg55

Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #4 on: July 27, 2020, 08:10:41 PM »
You're probably right Jeff.
I just saw it on a eBay listing for a SB 9 lathe. When it didn't sell, I contacted them and asked if they'd consider just selling the taper attachment and cross slide.
They agreed and I assumed it was for a 9.

Other than the height issue, it fit well on my 9 and was even less slop than my original.
I still think I might try cutting down a QCTP tool holder and see if it will work.
SB 9A, Clausing 8520, Sanford MG 612

Terrywerm

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Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2020, 12:52:44 PM »
If you are looking at cutting down original Aloris (correction: Dorian) tool holders, it might be worth purchasing one of the cheap ones from CDCO and cutting it down first.


Just a thought.


 :coffee2:
« Last Edit: July 28, 2020, 01:17:49 PM by Terrywerm »
Terry

Making chips with old machines!

jpigg55

Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2020, 01:50:41 PM »
Cheap QCTP tool holders are pretty much all I have. I picked up the Dorian QCTP at a really good price off eBay, but high end tool holders just not in the budget currently.
I did some measuring and milling off 0.100" or so off the bottom of the tool holders is looking to be the best option.
SB 9A, Clausing 8520, Sanford MG 612

chips and more

Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #7 on: August 03, 2020, 02:27:38 PM »
I realize that it could be a different experience. I tried to machine an Aloris tool holder once. It wasn’t any fun.

Jake Parker

Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #8 on: August 03, 2020, 04:49:49 PM »
Carbide end mills for sure!

jpigg55

Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #9 on: August 03, 2020, 10:12:32 PM »
From the comments, are the tool holders for QCTP's hardened ?
I assumed they weren't.
SB 9A, Clausing 8520, Sanford MG 612

Terrywerm

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Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2020, 05:03:26 AM »
I believe that the top brands might be case hardened, but I don't see any reason to harden them through. The inexpensive ones are probably not, but the only way to tell for sure is the good old file test.
Terry

Making chips with old machines!

woodchucker

Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2020, 07:25:36 AM »
I agree Terry, but I don't understand why they need to be hardened.
I have  chineese holders, they are not hardened, and while only AXA's they do the job.
Maybe in a CX they might need that, as the HP ramps up.. But in the AX, and BX I can't see the need.
Jeff
Clausing 8520   SB Model 9a - power hacksaw, Milwaukee band saw in a table.  Delta Rockwell Surface Grinder (not online yet .. being rebuilt where am I going to stick this)
For pics: https://imgur.com/user/woodchucker/posts

jpigg55

Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #12 on: August 04, 2020, 08:49:07 AM »
Mine are all Chinese and I planned on doing the file test.
I didn't figure I'd be losing much if taking a 100 thou or so off caused it to fail. I just figured it would be the easiest and cheapest option to try first.
SB 9A, Clausing 8520, Sanford MG 612

Terrywerm

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Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #13 on: August 04, 2020, 08:02:12 PM »
The only reason that I can think of for any of them to be case hardened would be to reduce wear from changing tools frequently. That would probably be more important for the tool post than for the tool holders, but you never know what the original designers came up with.


 :coffee2:
Terry

Making chips with old machines!

jocat54

Re: SON of a #!@**% !!!!!
« Reply #14 on: August 05, 2020, 12:54:55 AM »
I milled the dovetail on an AXA tool holder to fit my BXA tool post with a shop made carbide insert holder and it took a lot of really small cuts (.001-.002) but it is still working good. Probably could have taken larger cuts but I didn't really expect it to work out.
John